Today, TLC spoke to Diane Nelson, President of Warner Premiere, Warner Bros., who takes care of global brand management for HP, and Richard Harris, spokesperson for RDR Books, regarding the recently filed lawsuit against the publication of an unofficial Harry Potter encyclopedia, aiming to answer fan questions and clear up some confusion. A summation of each discussion is below. Please be reminded that no part of these discussions constitutes a legal answer to any of the claims made in the suit, or has legally binding implications. Also, the opinions and claims in each portion are owed to the agency discussed and do not constitute The Leaky Cauldron’s opinion or claim (of which it has none).
Warner Bros.
The original contact came about because the agencies became aware, in early September, that the Harry Potter Lexicon was slated to be published.
WB says they made numerous efforts to work with the publishing house, asking after the manuscript and offering to help make sure the book did not infringe and could be published without complaint, and all efforts were rebuffed.
The letter claiming rights on the DVD timeline was sent to the CEO of WB and seemed to them like an effort to take attention away from the cease and desist claims. The cease and desist letters constituted an attempt to open a dialogue.
The company claims they registered surprise at the letters from RDR, repeating that the Lexicon site is terrific, but that the proposed book fundamentally infringes J.K. Rowling’s rights.
WB claims to spend hundreds of hours vetting dozens of these types of books each year, and only goes to court (as in the case of Tanya Grotter) when the authors are not willing to make the necessary modifications.
It’s incumbent upon WB to act to protect J.K. Rowling’s rights in order to retain the rights; failure to act may in some (or future) situations be seen as giving up of rights. WB feels it has worked with fans in many ways, by providing elements and materials to allow them to continue in a manner that isn’t commercial. It granted Steve Vander Ark and the Lexicon the rights to use some of its art non-commercially, back in 2001.
According to WB, J.K. Rowling doesn’t have a problem with people publishing or commercially gaining from commentary or analysis, but reconfiguration of her work doesn’t apply.
The British publisher of the Lexicon book is cooperating with WB’s requests and engaging in a dialogue, but it isn’t the case in the U.S.
WB doesn’t feel this is an issue of first amendment rights, and that there are unequivocally no rights owed to the Lexicon for a timeline deriving from the rights of others.
There is no intention to have this suit apply to other fan endeavors such as web sites, wizard rock, etc.
RDR Books
All the following information is according to the RDR spokesperson, Richard Harris, and may be amended upon further discussions with the company.
RDR claims that Steve Vander Ark originally contacted J.K. Rowling, they think “via letters…over a period of months,” to ask to work with her to create an encyclopedic resource, and was rebuffed, which is when he sought out a publisher for the Lexicon. He made no further contact to the J.K. Rowling camp.
Roger Rapoport, the president of the company, was not in Germany selling rights to the book when the suit says he ways, says Mr. Harris. He was with his wife and brother-in-law, the latter of whom died of cancer at that time, and was the reason for which Mr. Rapoport asked for a good faith delay in answering the suit. [The suit claims that Mr. Rapoport was working on selling the rights to the book in Germany at this time, not that he was physically there.]
The book, according to RDR, is “a lexicon or reader’s guide. We’re not calling it an encyclopedia. [J.K. Rowling’s objection is that specifically we were calling it an encyclopedia.]”
[The suit does not claim that a name change will solve the issue or purport that the book was called an encyclopedia.]
The book contains critical analysis from “Steven Vander Ark and his staff.” When asked what he meant by critical analysis Mr. Harris said, “You can go to the site and read the articles. I’m not going to itemize them for you.” Questioned further he said “the book was typeset directly from the site,” and that it was word-for-word taken from the web site. (The RDR Web site now says “The entire book is drawn verbatim from the material that presently appears on Steve Vander Ark’s website.”)
RDR claims the book is not an infringement because “it’s a critical and educational review,” and, “we are not simply rearranging information.” Mr. Harris said a large portion of the book was “probably” typeset from the lexicon directly, though had “no idea” what proportion of the book is essays as compared to a catalogue of info. (However, there have been statements by Lexicon staff quoting Steve, that state there will be no essays in the book. Some essay authors are stating publicly that they have not been approached for permission.)
RDR claims not to have given JKR’s people a copy of the book because “we don’t have a copy to give them…because the book hasn’t been published yet.” Asked why they didn’t hand over a manuscript, Mr. Harris said, “how would it benefit us in any way? This is the result of a barrage of letters from their lawyers in the last two months. Late i the game they came forward and wanted to see the manuscript, after they’ve been threatening to sue us and everything. How is it going to help us in any way to show them the manuscript except to provide them with more information. At this stage are they going to say, ‘Oh, we’re sorry?’ and go away? I don’t think so.”
The publisher claims WB has been “threatening and abusive” since the beginning, and claims RDR would have been happy to discuss the book with them at any point.
RH: They received lots of response. We repeatedly told them yeah, give us a call, give Roger a call, and he will talk to you about it. TLC: That’s not what they put forth in their legal document. RH: [laughs] I know that’s not what they put forth in their legal document. Well aware of it. TLC: Then I want to make this clear because it’s serious: You’re saying that they bore false witness in that document. RH: We’ll answer that in our answer.
RDR Books admits that letters began in early September but claims that the original letters to come did not mention Warner Bros. Warner Bros. has told TLC that all letters clearly stated WB as a party.
RDR claims to have made an attempt to settle the matter quickly, and was rebuffed (WB has yet to respond to this claim).
Further questioned about whether the timeline of communications in the lawsuit is, therefore, correct, Mr. Harris said he did not have an answer.
RDR claims there are many factual errors in the suit but declined to discuss them individually before the case is answered legally.
It’s RDR’s position that the Lexicon did not need permission to do work on the book.
Disclaimer: These interviews do not constitute legally binding arguments.
The Harry Potter Lexicon has posted a statement on its “What’s New” page:
Dear Friends,
I would like to thank each and every one of you for your support in recent days. Everyone here at the Lexicon, all volunteers, regrets the unpleasantness. We have always been interested in working with the publishers of the novels to satisfy their concerns, interests and needs and we certainly do not plan nor have we ever planned to publish anything which competes with Ms. Rowling’s fine literary capabilities. Our work has nothing to do with fiction writing and is only concerned with legitimate critical analysis and academic considerations. It has been widely approved and employed by Ms. Rowling herself.
My book was started in response to many, many people who talked to me and asked if there could be a print version of the Lexicon, not in some sort of attempt to profit off of fans. Because the material for the book was not only accepted but praised and used frequently by every entity concerned with creating the Harry Potter books, games, and films, I would never have thought that a print version could be judged differently.
I sincerely hope that this matter can be resolved amicably and ask for you patience and understanding during that process.
Steve
Steve Vander Ark
The Harry Potter Lexicon
The Harry Potter Lexicon is a partner site to the Leaky Cauldron.
If anyone wants a full detailed explaination as to why this is an illegal attempt on Ark’s behalf, go check out praetorianguard’s blog on the subject:
http://praetorianguard.livejournal.com/270707.html
It’s a very good read and explains the legality issues.
Other than that, I support any artist, film-makers or author’s right to protect their work, REGARDLESS of how much money they have in the bank! Stop being to fickle, people, you just come off envious and shallow.
To Melissa and the rest of Leaky’s staff: Thank you for bringing us these facts in a professional, objective manner. We’re very lucky to have a source of real journalism from people who know so much about the books, the author, and the fandom.
I was especially pleased to see your statement that the opinions expressed in this piece “do not constitute The Leaky Cauldron’s opinion or claim (of which it has none).”
Kimberly, no apologies for my calling it what the local university calls it… I just called it the new name out of habit and then wanted to explain it was really the same thing.
Thanks to those who posted the blogs. I have to say, I disagree with the first attorney, or at least if I was a juror listening to his argument, he wouldn’t convince me. Whether or not the profits for Jo’s compendium/encyclopedia goes to charity, or just her royalties, is completely irrelevant. If she was keeping all the money, it would still be a case of possible copyright infringement.
Also, if it is true that it was due to be published on November 28, it is complete BS that they don’t have a copy to give to the attorney’s for WB and JK Rowling.
Those of you who have written essays for the Lexicon need to take some sort of web “snapshot” if possible – to show whether or not there is something that stated if you submit your essay that you give permission for it to be published on paper.
I agree with those who say that all this sad business might force JKR distance herself from her fans. She used to do these cute things, like comment on fandom, give fansites awards, freely talk to her fans. Well, I suspect now she is getting some sobering legal advice – not to do it anymore. Some other writers, like Terry Pratchett, admit to be very careful as to how they interact with their fans – precisely because of possible copyright issues and lawsuits involving former devoted fans…
An interesting bit of info – I searched “Harry Potter reference” and other related searches – and this is what I got. I have a sneaking suspiccion that the Lexicon is no different from some of these books – maybe more complete. How are all these books different from SVA’s?
The Unofficial Harry Potter Encyclopedia: Harry Potter A – Z by Kristina Benson (Paperback – Jul 7, 2007)
The Complete Idiot’s Guide to the World of Harry Potter (Complete Idiot’s Guide to) by Tere Stouffer (Paperback – Oct 2, 2007)
Ultimate Unofficial Guide to the Mysteries of Harry Potter (Analysis of Book 5) by Galadriel Waters, E. L. Fossa, Astre Mithrandir, and E.L. Fossa (Paperback – Jul 8, 2005)
Fact, Fiction, and Folklore in Harry Potter’s World: An Unofficial Guide by George W. Beahm, Tim Kirk, and Britton McDaniel (Paperback – Jun 30, 2005)
The Sorcerer’s Companion: A Guide to the Magical World of Harry Potter by Allan Zola Kronzek and Elizabeth Kronzek (Paperback – Aug 10, 2004
Muggles and Magic: An Unofficial Guide to J.k. Rowling and the Harry Potter Phenomenon by George W. Beahm and Tim Kirk (Paperback – April 11, 2007)
The Pottersaurus: 1,500 Words Harry Potter Readers Need to Know by Eric D. Randall (Paperback – April 26, 2007)
Mugglenet.Com’s What Will Happen in Harry Potter 7: Who Lives, Who Dies, Who Falls in Love and How Will the Adventure Finally End by Ben Schoen, Emerson Spartz, Andy Gordon, and Gretchen Stull (Paperback – Nov 20, 2006)
The Magical Worlds of Harry Potter: A Treasury of Myths, Legends, and Fascinating Facts by David Colbert (Paperback - May 4, 2004)
The Definitive Harry Potter Guide Book Series: The Prisoner of Azkaban by Marie Lesoway (Spiral-bound – 2001)
The Definitive Harry Potter Guide Book Series: The Philosophers Stone by Marie Lesoway (Spiral-bound – 2001)
An Unofficial Muggle’s Guide to the Wizarding World: Exploring the Harry Potter Universe by Fionna Boyle (Paperback – Sep 1, 2004)
A Muggles Guide To The Wizarding World: Exploring The Harry Potter Universe: Fionna Boyle
Paperback, 2004
Ultimate Unofficial Guide to the Mysteries of Harry Potter: Astre Mithrandir, Galadriel Waters
Paperback, 2003
Mapping the World of Harry Potter: Mercedes Lackey
Paperback, 2006
The Plot Thickens… Harry Potter Investigated By Fans For Fans: Galadriel Waters
Paperback, 2004
The Harry Potter Companion: Acascias Riphouse
Paperback, 2004
A Detective’s Analysis of Harry Potter and the Mysteries Within: Mary C. Baumann
Hardcover, 2004
I wish people would stop assuming that because people have money, they are greedy. We really have no idea what JKR does with her fortune, we are not her accountants. Occasionally we hear about her giving to charities, but this does not neccessarily mean that she does not give money to charity that we do not know about. I mean come on, the woman started her own charitable organization, I find it hard to believe that she does not contribute money to that organization rather frequently.
Some are also claiming that the Lexicon book would not take away proceeds from Rowling’s book. Their evidence: I would buy both. I’m sure most die-hard fans would by both, but the problem is that most fans are not die-hard fans. Most fans have never ventured onto the internet HP world and would not know that there are two encyclopedias: the Lexicon’s and Jo’s future encyclopedia. So let me set up a situation: A standard Harry Potter fan (one who has read at least most of the books at least once, but doesn’t know a thing about online Harry Potter news and fandom) walks into a bookstore and sees “Harry Potter Lexicon.” For whatever reason, they buy it. Two or three years later they walk into the bookstore again and see “Harry Potter Encyclopedia.” Because they don’t go online and get all the good information they probably won’t realize that there is a difference between these two books. They’ll think, why in the world should I buy another encyclopedia, especially since they probably hardly ever even used the first one they bought.
This is one of the comments in the wall street journal’s blog link that someone posted on page 4. I thought it was an interesting read.
“Ah, the deja vu! Looking over Rowling’s complain to the court, I had a delightful flashback to days not so long ago when, defending myself in Seattle federal court, I took on what must be the second wealthiest literary property in the English-speaking world, that of J. R. R. Tolkien. Now there’s a remarkably similar case coming from what must be the wealthiest literary property on the planet.
There are the same nasty attacks, alleging illicit motivations on the part of defendants that the Rowling’s lawyers have no way of knowing. Consider them lies, because that’s what they were in my case. You should also consider flipping the allegations of greed around. Never, when lawyers are involved, neglect their enormous desire to bill as many hours as possible to a deep-pocketed client. There’s undoubtedly more greed per square inch in the Times Square offices of O’Melveny & Myers than there is at all of Michigan-based RDR Books (a company whose list of titles demonstrates a love of good literature)–much less the original source of the book at the fan website of hp-lexicon.org.
You can also see hints of that billable-hours greed in the rather pitiful attempt one of the Rowling’s lawyer makes to describe her books. A lover of great literature he is not: “Over the course of these seven books, Harry learns many new things, makes new friends, travels, and has many adventures.” That’s how a fifth-grader writes a book report. In this case that fifth-grader, now grown old and cranky, was billing Rowling perhaps $500/hour. That sort of pay will make almost anyone think they’re a literary genius.
Fortunately, in law, money doesn’t always win. The Tolkien estate must have spent close to a quarter of a million dollars trying to stop my book-length Lord of the Rings chronology, Untangling Tolkien. I spent some $4,000 to utterly vanquish them. Just before a judge would have responded to concurrent motions for summary judgment, they bailed out, offering in a letter to settle for a “few changes.” Three months later the judge changed their “little hope” to “no hope” by dismissing their lawsuit “with prejudice.” You can find my book on Amazon and traces of my fair use arguments to the court in the last chapter.
Lawyers can be strange. In the Rowlings complaint, there’s an attempt to put the billionaire Rowlings into the role of a struggling writer for whom every penny counts. Only a lawyer with a large, six-figure income would try to portray her as a victim, particularly since her stated rationale is nothing more than a monopolistic desire prevent any competition to an encyclopedia she wants to write. A good defense lawyer could make mincemeat of her claims there. Numerous copyright disputes have made it clear that no author, fictional or non-fictional, can silence critics. The public interest in that is so great, that in the Beannie Babies case a few years back, it cast aside a visual copyright to any commercial use of pictures of the collectable doll.
The biggest weakness in the RDR Book lawsuit may be that their book is too nice with her corpus. It should take a critical look at where her plot is weak and her characters unconvincing. My Tolkien chronology did that. His time line was remarkably accurate, but I do point out the few places he got it wrong. In the eyes of a court, an author (or in my case, Tolkien’s son Christopher), can’t be trusted to do that. And what matters with something as trite as collectable dolls, certainly matters for one of the bestselling books on the planet.
RDR Books also has one marvelous advantage that I didn’t have, the fact that much of their book has apparently been posted for years on a fan website with Rowlings and her lawyers doing nothing about it. Given the modest profit margins of most small publishers and the little or nothing that the contributors to this book will be getting, the “commercial” portion of copyright fair use will carry little weight before a fair court. By not enforcing her claims with websites, she’s virtually conceded them for a book. The downside of that is when lawyers see that, they’ll get nasty with fan websites. But then intellectual property lawyers are always getting into nasty little snits, all the more so when their cases are weak.
And that brings up Rowling’s primary advantage. The case has been filed in SDNY-the Southern District of New York, because there the court, operating cheek-and-jowl with powerful NYC publishers, is notoriously tilted in favor of rich copyright holders. It’s the intellectual property equivalent of lawsuits filed against giant corporations in obscure Marshall, Texas.
You see that bias in how Manhattan IP lawyers often act before judges. My opponent was so used to differential-to-plaintiffs SDNY judges, he blundered badly before the Ninth Circuit judge in my case. I still smile when I recall his attempt to tell the judge how she ought to rule in one of our disputes. He was on the phone from Manhattan. I was a few feet away from the judge and could sense her growing impatience. Needless to say, I won.
In my case, virtually all the decisions my opponents were citing came from a few 1998 rulings in the SDNY, decisions that have been soundly criticized in law journals and that, fortunately for me, do not bind a Ninth Circuit court. In the almost a decade since those decisions, no other circuit has bought the Second Circuit’s rather extreme claims about the reach of a fictional copyright (i.e. banning unauthorized reader’s guides). One Midwest court even dismissed the Second Court’s argument as “frivolous,” which indeed it was.
The one good thing about this dispute is that it may force the Second Circuit to recant its 1998 blunder. I had the counsel for a university press tell me that, since those rulings, his press has avoid publishing anything about popular, contemporary fiction. That’s precisely the “chilling effect” the fair use provisions of copyright law are intended to prevent.
–Michael W. Perry, author of Untangling Tolkien
P.S. I assert no copyright to these remarks, so Harry Potter websites are free to post what I’ve written here online. And if Steve Vander Ark would contact me through my website, InklingBooks.com, I’d be happy to offer him advice as someone who’s been through what he’s been through.”
Comment by Michael W. Perry – November 3, 2007 at 3:10 pm
Chthonia – if I didn’t know better, I’d think you’re Steve himself … :)
Chris – LOL, indeed! Very refreshing …
For the rest – beyond all the Legalese, I simply still do not understand how SVA could do this to Jo – and us – after it had obviously become clear very quickly that she didn’t think it was a good idea.
As has been said before, THAT would have been the point to drop it.
Ah – it appears the Lexicon troops are out in force.
But really – that Michael W. Perry comment backfires badly: what a self-righteous creep!
He’s not arguing the merits of his work at all, only how he won against a big literary estate. His entire rant is completely beside the point: it does not matter how “big” his opponent is, how much money JKR has and SVA does not have, whether or not RDR has a love of literature (!). Copyright is necessary precisely because of people like him, who have no scruples whatsoever to profit from others’ work.
And he may have some experience with such a court case – and hence certainly isn’t exactly unbiased – but he’s doing precisely what he accuses WB of: making “nasty attacks, alleging illicit motivations”. Pathetic. Not enough talent to come up with anything worthwhile of his own and just seeking to cash in on others’.
Finally – his presumption is breathtaking: “I assert no copyright to these remarks, so Harry Potter websites are free to post what I’ve written here online.” LOL. Goodness knows, we wouldn’t want to miss that.
Just for the records: I am nobody’s “trooper” and I don’t post on behalf of the Lexicon.
Though, I think the Lexicon is impressive. Some years ago, I spent many hours on the site – with the time-lines, later on with the maps, and, above all, with the linguistic references, e.g. to strictly British language use. This is such a help for non-anglophones who read and re-read the original version of the Potter books; it helped me to understand what JKR has written. I abhorred most of the Lexcion’s artwork; anyway, I considered the Lexicon as much more interesting than the fan-sites and forums (sorry, just being honest and just being too old for unbiased fandom).
It takes two to tango, as they say. I do legal work (and I run a writer’s blog under Creative Commons; when referring to others’ work, which I frequently do, I must be constantly aware of copyright issues). The lawsuit upset me because I tend to be partisan in ‘Goliath vs David’ cases. And a small publishing house in Michigan is David, compared to Goliath WB. One of the basic principles of fair trial is: ‘Et altera pars audietur’.
Well, tomorrow is Monday; another working week begins, so I won’t be able to post any more. I say goodbye to you all, best wishes.
Thank you for continuing to cover this story in detail and giving both sides an opportunity to share. I have always thought Melissa et al. were great and I am even more impressed. It’s great to have a journalist at the helm of a site like this! I am also very impressed since I am imagine this is a difficult situation given your relationship with Steve and Jo.
You know, I have given this a lot more thought, and I am about to risk alienating many fans who insist on defending WB and the WB Lawyers, who I feel are the real culprits here. Could anyone be deluded enough to really believe that WB is opperating on good faith here? If so, I have a lake in the middle of Arizona I’d like to sell you. Have people forgotten that WB in 2001, prior to the release of the first film, shot out a number of ceast and desist letters to a number of HP fan sites? If I recall, wasn’t their knee-jerk rationalization was that the fan sites might deminish the value of the franchise? I have to admit, if the issue has to do with the book being a ‘reference based book’, plenty of other published books about Potter have reference materials. Why the sudden change? The WB Lawyers are not above stretching the truth and paint a bleak picture fro the personal aims. For instance, Steve’s previous comment that’s quoted in the brief about protecting his own intellectual propperty. I remember that post from the Lexicon’s comment and it was in reference to someone else, who runs another HP fan site, who was copying his writing, claiming it as their own and profiting from it, which triggered legal action by Steve’s lawyers. Do I agree that Steve should have handled this matter differently and distanced himself from RDR? yes I do. Do I trust the WB lawyers? No I don’t. That’s based on their corporate track record. The last point is my concern and I am aware that it might be sacrilegious to many fans to say this. Yet perhaps JK Rowling learn a lesson and take a page out of George Lucas. Lucas used to have the good will of his fan base until he squandered it. Joanne needs to not assume the fan base will not walk away if there’s a continual stream of controversy. All phenomenon’s have their cycles, people drift away and loose interest. While I admit there will always be the loyal fan’s. Joanne should not take for granted this juggernaut will remain this way forever. Based on what I’ve observed concerning pop culture, all phenomenons loose steam sooner or later. That’s just reality folks. Bottom line, I’m not willing to put blind faith in the corporate lawyers.
Sadly, from RDR’s terrible defense and from it’s own description of the lexicon book, I can see that JKR has every legal right to sue. It is copyright infringement, and it is entirely based off her work.
My question is: Why can’t she just let him publish anyway?
The idea that Steve’s book would take money away from hers is laughable. Nobody HP obsessed enough to buy the lexicon would NOT buy JKR’s own encyclopedia. Likewise, the argument that his book would take away money from charity is unfair. If JKR’s so worried about the charity, why doesn’t she just let Steve publish his book, and donate some extra money herself? After all, she can surely afford it. Steve worked incredibly hard on his lexicon, and, while he has no legal right to sell it, I think he has done enough work as a dedicated fan that JKR should simply let him. She’s got nothing to lose, and suing him for doing something that does not detract from (In fact, I’d certainly say it adds to) her or her work in any way is unnecessarily heartless.
If I was an author, and somebody put that much work into my fictional universe, I’d be thrilled.
Posted by Bibliophile1776 on November 05, 2007, 02:01 AM
report to moderator
Uncle Vernon, Aunt Petunia, and Dudley were Harry's only living relatives. They were Muggles who hated and despised magic in any form, which meant that Harry was about as welcome in their house as dry rot.
If anyone wants a full detailed explaination as to why this is an illegal attempt on Ark’s behalf, go check out praetorianguard’s blog on the subject: http://praetorianguard.livejournal.com/270707.html
It’s a very good read and explains the legality issues.
Other than that, I support any artist, film-makers or author’s right to protect their work, REGARDLESS of how much money they have in the bank! Stop being to fickle, people, you just come off envious and shallow.