I have a couple of questions I am really struggling with. If we take RDR and SVA at their word, they both insist that the book was never going to be a huge money maker through sales, how then did they expect to generate a respectable income from it? RDR is a business after all, and the issue of making money seems to be SVA’s main peeve in this interview.

From all I have read on the court testimony and the documents filed, I can’t help but feel RDR were being difficult to negotiate with before this whole thing was forced to trial, and I am wondering what they hoped to gain by it. Now the judge has suggested they settle, but what would RDR agree to? If the book, as they testified, was never meant to make a lot of money, why do they persist? They don’t see a gain if they win, and they lose everything if they don’t win…there has to be something they’re hoping for here, otherwise none of this makes any sense. Am I missing something?

I support Jo and Warner Brothers completely in this law suit. I believe it is never Ok for someone to plagiarise another’s work, particularly something that has been worked on for over a decade. By giving no further analysis on the books, and just repeatings facts in another book, Steve has plagiarised a work that means a lot to may fans across the world.

However, I do believe that as a fandom we need to start respecting one another’s opinions. While we all may feel differently about this law suit, it is okay to support EITHER case if you want to. As a fandom we are usually quite tolerant, but I’ve seen a lot of hatred expressed towards those who are supporting Steve and RDR, and I do not support that hatred.

So feel free to have your opinion, but remember that the Harry Potter books are about expressing tolerance. Don’t lose sight of this message throughout this law suit.

@Amanda, i agree with you completely, some of these comments makes me really scared about the reality of mob mentality. i mean, wow. maybe it’s that i’m 24, or that i’ve been the victim of single minded prejudace, but i for one, never jump to conclusions and try my best to veiw things from all sides. what i can make out about this case is that

a) JKR didn’t want any one else to write an encyclopedia to HP, whether they legally could under fair use or no. the cease and disists went out to the lexicon and mugglenet before demanding seeing a copy of the book. it was a scare tactic, it worked for mugglenet, it didn’t work for RDR

b) RDR being told that they legally couldn’t write this book by WB, when by all accounts they could as long as they followed Fair Use copy write laws, put their backs up. they are after all the “little guys” here.

c) RDR’s rush to get the book out and all around dumbassery screwed them over big time, by being very snide, confrontational, and provoking to WB and not taking the time to make sure the Lexicon book Was well put together, properly cited, and did not copy an abundant amount of direct text from HP.

to me it still seems the bulk of the blame fall on RDR. what i want to know is at what point JKR was willing to allow a rewrite and at what point SVA was willing to do one. this is where a compromise could have settled this whole thing. JKR saying “during her testimony that Vander Ark could still do his book, as long as he changed it to take less of her material”, makes me raise an eyebrow… after all they did tell him Not to write an encyclopidia before asking to see a version of it. SVA saying he’s have been willing to rewrite makes me wonder how much controll RDR had over what was going on between lawyers and how much influence SVA had.

something that’s really bothering me is peoples insistance that wanting to print the lexicon is greedy but wizard wrock is in some way different… after all why buy a cd when you can listen to it for free on myspace? Honestly, i would’ve wanted a book form of the lexicon, i know many devoted HP fans who would’ve wanted it, i know many casual readers that would have wanted it. there is no question that there is a demand Now, not in 6 years or however long it takes her to write the scotish book, but Now for an easy use reference guide to HP, and oh look, the Lexicon just happens to have one on hand, why not publish it? Leaky fans, HP fans, PC fans, would all be out there buying one, if only to own part of the fandom, something we created ourselves for ourselves… except that JKR said NO. now all of a sudden SVA is the devil. and i tell you, i’ve learned more about this mans private life then i ever wanted to, trust me, wether or not a 50 year old man drops his life to move to England has never been of personal interest to me, and i really wish people would stop bringing it up as if his character had something to do with how much control JKR has over copywrite.

i don’t believe that either side is being evil greedy capitalist here. i believe JKR when she says she has enough money but that that should not be a factor when it comes to protecting her work, i believe that the initial desire to print the Lexicon was based more upon the pride of having your hard work and devotion set in print and in some way legitimised. i’ll be honest and come right out and say it, though i believe that JKR should win this case, based on the poor quality and blatent copywrite of the book, but i think that SVA has the right principles in mind and that if the book had’ve been properly put together, he would then be in the right. based on the fact that WB demanded the book be shut down before asking for a manuscript leads me to believe that they were working under the delusion that they can control anything HP related. this case aside, look at the big picture here, an author should have some control, yes, but not full control over everything that is ever writen about their series. this is where Fair Use becomes fuzzy. i am very glad that Malissa touched upon this in the latest Pottercast, when she said that if JKR told her she didn’t like some of the things in her book and tried to shut it down, she would fight it… but i still have to ask, had the lexicon done it’s citations properly and done a better job of paraphrasing, where exactly everyones loyalties would lie?

this has gotten much longer then i intended, i’ve just been following this case from the beginning and an awful lot of ignorant, poorly thoughtout statments have been made by so many posters that it’s really gotten to me. i just want to ask people to please please please set aside your blatent devotions to JKR and look at this from an outsiders prospective. i love JKR too, i go to cons, HP has changed my life, i write wizardrock and i am in other online fandoms that have stricter authors then her, trust me, i know the seriousness of this case. honestly, i’m terrified of a set presidence being set either way. on one hand you have authors becomming more stict in online activity, on the other you have authors gaining control over what could be critical commentary of their work (i realise this is not what the lexicon is, but the law is vegue for a reason).

personally, i took JKR stating she may become too disheartend to write her book, as a threat. i don’t take kindly to threats. i’m willing to give her the benifit of the doubt and say that being in court was very stressful and it may have simply been an emotional response. but if it’s not… well, i see that as simply being vindictive, and though i’ll ever remain a fan of HP i won’t be able to say the same of someone who chose to punish her fans for the actions of one company.

ok i think i’ve writen a long enough essay now.

@Amanda

I agree! There are many scary parallels between the HP stories and what is happening now, both inside and outside the court. For me the scariest is this attitude of fans that one has to 100% agree with Jo, and that one has to say truly ugly things about SVA and never concede that he may have any merit…

“The world is not divided into good people and death-eaters”, it’s all a little more grey than that.

@siyrean

I have to disagree. I would rather wait another 6 years to get the complete book from JKR than to have a book form of a website that JKR deeps “sloppy, lazy” and in many cases inaccurate. That’s my hard earned money that I’m spending on this book and I’d rather wait for a book that is complete and written by someone who knows HP inside and out. The only person who truly knows everything, and I do mean everything, about HP is JKR.

I do agree that “the world is not divided into good people and death-eaters”. As that line is being sprouted about on this post I feel the need to address it. I do agree. I don’t think SVA is a bad person. I would never categorize him in the death-eaters category. He did make a mistake though.

I also think his profession and age do matter in this case. As a college student and someone three decades younger than SVA, I know the consequences for not citing correctly. I know that my academic career is on the line and subsequently my professional career. His profession is of precedence only because a man who was a middle school librarian would know the rules of plagiarism and would more likely than not, have taught several classes to students on how to site properly. I was often brought into the library in 5th-8th grade to be taught how to search reference books and then how to cite them in my papers – all by the librarians. Because of this, his profession is important.

I know there are some here that want to vilify SVA. That makes it easier. If you can stick a big red sticker on him that says “EVIL” then it makes it easier than to think that someone, just like us, who spends their time on HP websites, conversing with others, could put JKR in a position where she feels so hurt and betrayed. For many of us, JKR is someone we’ve never met, but someone we still consider a friend. She gave us 7 fantastic novels and an entire cast of characters that we all feel we know by heart. How could we feel anything else?

Also, JKR stating that she might, in the end, not have the spirit to write the Scottish Book was not a threat. Rather, a statement of fact. A proof that this is taking its toll on her and if she has to go through all of this and in the end she is told that anyone can take her work and profit off of it? Work that she slaved over, kept notes upon notes about? Heck, I’d lose the heart to write myself. I’d lose the heart to ever write again.

There are always two sides to every story. Many of us don’t want to hear SVA’s simply because we love JKR all so much. And we have the right to love her, she gave us a reason for being on this site, a reason for this site to exist. SVA bringing JKR into court feels like a betrayal to many in the fandom because he was a member of the fandom, and it’s as though he is dragging the “fandom” name through the mud in the process, making it look like every member of any fandom is out to get the authors.

I have no doubt that Steve Vander Ark is a good guy caught in a bad situation. He signed a contract and probably didn’t realize how badly he was digging his own grave. RDR has no personal interest in this case. They don’t love HP the way SVA and JKR do, so they have no cares for whether or not the Lexicon is accurate. RDR is in it for the money it will make their company. SVA wanted to give something to his other fan mates, unfortunately he chose to do so in the wrong way.

I hope that this can be settled in the right way. I hope that in the end its settled in a way that makes Jo Rowling happy. Because above all, if the creator of a universe feels like that universe is being ripped to shreds, they aren’t going to want to help keep it alive. And I love the Harry Potter Universe and want Jo Rowling to be a part of it and help keep it alive with The Scottish book. I want her there helping write the scripts for Deathly Hallows Parts 1 and 2. I want her to finish Harry Potter fully the way she has always wanted to do it, without feeling like someone else is going to follow behind her and tear it apart.

I still dont get how people are complaining that it’s fine to buy Wrock CDs but not fine for Steve to publish this book. It’s the same reason why it’s fine for Mugglenet to publish a “What will Happen in Book 7” book and not fine for Steve to do the Lexicon. Jo being the creator obviously thinks that the books and companion stuff that are published and sold add enough original material to her work and not just take it and resell it.

I see why some people get confused when (like siyrean wrote) “the cease and disists went out to the lexicon and mugglenet before demanding seeing a copy of the book.” But personally I can understand Jo asking people not to write a book about her world she wants write herself. And then why not stop them if they infringe her copyright. Maybe that is not the law, but I still think it’s her right after all the years of work and creation she put into it.

If Steve wants the book to come out without Jo raising objections, it’d have to be trimmed, a LOT. If it takes 91% of her work and just reprints it, trimming it is not going to be easy. And, I don’t get his comparison with wizard rock bands and stuff. There’s a difference here. Wrock is within copyright, your book is not. That’s the issue. And as for the fandom, well, Steve, sorry, but I think you’re going to be having a tough time within the fandom now.

This is so very sad…a person who used to be held in high regard by not only JK …but all the Potter Fans…has fallen so far…and is now shunned by nearly everyone who used to support him….all because of money. (that can be his ONLY motivation…its certainly wasn’t for us fans or charity) I might have liked a Lexicon book…but if JK says no (which is her RIGHT)...I am completely happy with just using the web lexicon. I sure as hell am not buying his book after all of his untruths…He seems to think he speaks for us fans.

He keeps getting chance after chance to redeem himself…but continues down the path to the dark side. Surely he has some close friends who are Potter maniacs who are telling he is alienating himself from all his friends? cue dramatic scene on a volcano planet SVA’s friend: “SVA you’re breaking my heart…You’re going down a path I can’t follow”...

@all extremely outraged Rowlingphiles

You know, there is a word to describe people who loudly proclaim one point of view and viciously attack those to dare to disagree: mob.

I believe the legacy of the HP series is aptly displayed here. Anyone with a dissenting POV should be cast aside in favor of those to who pay proper homage and respect to The Chosen One. In the fervor to honor the chosen ones, no tactics are out-of-bounds: lying, cheating, bullying are all perfectly fine. And when you’re in a pinch please add a bit of torture or mind-control! As long as the greater good is preserved, All Is Well!

Anyway, I just stopped in to catch up on the outrage over the very idea of someone finding fault with JKR and her lawsuit. And I stand by my claims of greed as her motive here. I’ll further cite the authorization of HP land and DH becoming 2 films (good luck with that one, Yates!) as greed evidence. And for those actually thinking while reading, there is more to greed than the accumulation of wealth. (Or was young Snape’s greedy look at Lily about his plans to steal her money?)

I’ll happily buy a of copy of the Lexicon if it’s ever published.

@ Aurora, pottershrink

Thank you both!! I couldn’t agree more with what you both have written. It’s heartbreaking all that’s been going on here lately. I hope some of you remember that there’s a difference between attacking a person and attacking a person’s actions. SVA is on trial because of what he DID not because of who he IS.

@siyrean

Thank you as well, I enjoyed reading your post. And I would like to comment on your last paragraph because this has been bothering me as well >”personally, i took JKR stating she may become too disheartend to write her book, as a threat. ” Yes, I took it as a threat too; and I too think that if she decides not to publish her book she will be punishing not only her fans, but also the charity of her choice. An that indeed would be a terrible thing to DO.

Posted by Marissa: “I’m still baffled by those of you making remarks along the lines of “Well, Jo wasn’t interested in writing another Potter book until STEVE decided to do one.” That’s completely untrue. She has mentioned many times over the years, well before Book 7 was out, that she might well end up doing an encyclopedia of sorts once the main story was told.”

Yes. Although something did happen when this controversy began: the possible JKR encyclopedia started to be referred to as “The Scottish Book” :-)

I have a feeling Jeanne is someone closely associated with SVA/Lexicon or someone who doesn’t like JK. Because the leaps in logic she is taking seems prominent in only those who are devoutly devoted to one point of view…and will find any minor scrap of information to justify or support their points of view.

Just my humble opinion…

Ugh! I don’t believe it! I just lost a lengthy and thoughtful post! (makes mental note to copy text before pressing “post”). I’ll attempt to recreate it. :-(

”@all extremely outraged Rowlingphiles

You know, there is a word to describe people who loudly proclaim one point of view and viciously attack those to dare to disagree: mob.

I believe the legacy of the HP series is aptly displayed here. Anyone with a dissenting POV should be cast aside in favor of those to who pay proper homage and respect to The Chosen One. In the fervor to honor the chosen ones, no tactics are out-of-bounds: lying, cheating, bullying are all perfectly fine. And when you’re in a pinch please add a bit of torture or mind-control! As long as the greater good is preserved, All Is Well!

Anyway, I just stopped in to catch up on the outrage over the very idea of someone finding fault with JKR and her lawsuit. And I stand by my claims of greed as her motive here. I’ll further cite the authorization of HP land and DH becoming 2 films (good luck with that one, Yates!) as greed evidence. And for those actually thinking while reading, there is more to greed than the accumulation of wealth. (Or was young Snape’s greedy look at Lily about his plans to steal her money?)

I’ll happily buy a of copy of the Lexicon if it’s ever published.”

Posted by Jeanne on April 22, 2008 @ 01:56 AM

Well, I guess I’d fall into the category of what you call a “Rowlingphile.” I prefer “author supporter” or “on the side of the law,” though. There’s no reason for thinly veiled insults, you know. They’re just as bad as hostile ones.

Speaking of hostile insults, I don’t agree with any of the people, on either side, who have been very hostile to the opposing side. We all have every right to express our opinion without being called “not true HP fans” or “blind lemmings following the trail of Jo” or whatever people have been called.

Well, that assessment of this whole situation being similar to the message of the books only holds water if one holds that view of the books, so I would say a very small portion of people reading this would agree with you there. Frankly, I think the theme of choices applies more to the case, or at least events leading up to the lawsuit, more than anything else. RDR made the choice to evade WB and Jo’s agency. SVA made the choice to not specifically ask the agency how to go about publishing part of his website. “Oh what a tangled web we weave” also applies here very well.

As neither you nor I are privy to Jo’s thoughts about the theme park and have no statements about it to infer her thoughts, neither one of us can make a judgement. I’m sure you’re not surprised that my instinct is the very opposite of yours. My instinct is that she’s allowing it for her fans to enjoy. We have no idea how much money she will get from it, so to say she did it in greed is a bit of leap on your part.

As for the films, I have no idea how much say she has in that type of thing. If she did have to give her approval of making DH into two parts, then I would think she would do it to ensure as much of her book makes it in.

I have to say, though, Joanne that you sound rather hateful towards not only Jo, but the books themselves. So, what pleasure do you get out of them?

/response to Joanne

SVA continues to disappoint with every word he utters. It makes me immensely sad to see this whole thing divide the fandom. I don’t think the schism between Steve and part of the fandom came about because of the lawsuit. I, for one, was of the mind that Steve was truly trapped in his contract and didn’t agree with RDR. That is until he opened his mouth in a couple of interviews. And then once I got deeper into the facts of the case, I realized that not only do I think that WB/JKR are legally right, but that RDR/SVA were ethically wrong.

@dorito: your name makes me hungry :-P

Argh! Sorry. Jeanne not Joanne.

@ DracoDaDeathEater I was thinking the same thing, becase her logic is just…strange. Especially the part about “no tactics are out-of-bounds: lying, cheating, bullying are all perfectly fine” made me laugh out loud…because it’s so completely true, just not concerning Jo/WB but Steve/RDR…especially the lying and cheating part. They keep lying whenever they open their mouths…“Well, I offered that months and months ago… and said, ‘Is there other edits we can make?’ ‘Can we make changes?’ … and they… no, there was nothing offered at all.” yeah, sure…I remember it being reportet that RDR told Jo’s lawyers just to push the print button if they want a manuscript. Clearly it’s APPALLING how Jo could not accept all the offers about editing that were made….how very greedy of her…rollseyes