JKR/WB should win no only on a moral basis, and on a basis of the law as its currently stands, but also on the basis that RDR at no point in this entire fiasco entered in a legitamate speck of evidence. they were all talk, but provided not factual substence.
saying a book is transformative and fair use dosent mean anything unless you point out why it is, which they never did at all.
Roger rappaport can say a apple is a sports car, and if so, i say he should sit on a apple and try to do 140kilometers on the autoban. that way we can laugh at him for being the idiot on the side of the road with a apple up his butt and cars shooting by.
we can laugh at him for being a idiot and not providing a single point of evidence that the lexicon manuscript is fair use, and transformative, and therefore should be published. all he did was say it was, but never fulfill his burden of proof.
Impressive summary.
Romulus & Remus, “raised by wolves”. So this is really interesting news when there was so much talk about scholarly standards. Of course, in roman mythology it was one she-wolf, in latin lupa; cf lupinus 3; the god lupercus; and by the way, lupanar, which I won’t translate.
nicely put liz, IF SVA had gotten aan independant legal opiniononf wheather or not his print version of the lexicon would be a copyright violation he could have likely avoided a lot of trouble
but from the court documents about his contract with RDR, it is blatantly clear he knew it was illegal. if he thought it was legal, there would be no reason to have himself indemified. given that from the moment the court case began, to the court trial itself, he stated what he was doing is legal, it shows he clearly has issues, because on the stand, he said he knew it wasent, but RDR bullied him.
also, it should be noted, if he truly was a fan, when jk rowling’s people sent cease and desist letter to him, he would have bent over backwards to work with her. no fan would deny her the right to challange and verify the legality of any book they have written about her copyrighted and trademarked works.
The “fair use” status of a concordance is well established. No college literature student of James Joyce’s “Ulysses” gets far without reference to a justly famous concordance to the work. The concordance itself is acknowledged as brilliant scholarship.
Vander Ark’s concordance might not be quite up to that standard, but nevertheless it represents original effort in collating and classifying Potter elements. When Rowling offers that Vander Ark’s efforts do not amount to a “serious” work she implicitly argues that “Harry Potter” itself is not a serious work. Potter is no “Ulysses” and Rowling no James Joyce.
It would seem to me that fans of the work, as opposed to sychophants of the Potter author, would welcome an outsider creating this concordance as opposed to Rowling. She is notoriously confused when it comes to “facts” and notoriously disposed to tinker with the canon in forums outside the books themselves. I feel that Vander Ark’s product is likelly to be better organized and less biased (inclined to “fix” problems in the series after-the-fact).
It is high time to Rowling to let go. In a very real sense Potter is a “trial balloon”, and trial balloons either fly or get shot down by the critics. Mommy can’t protect little Harry forever.
This was a lawsuit that doesn’t need to happen…....especially in the u.s…...
I’ve just made money off my writing for many years; not as much as jkr…but I made a living…
I love jkr and her writings….
I love sva because he gave us answer, or at least additional clues…and commenary on my questions over the years..
I’ve used the Lexi enough to acquiese to them, some sort of profit after all these years…
As for JKR she never told/explained to this fan why I’d purchase the SVA Lexi…vs the JKR Enclopedia….her fans are rabid…we want it all…authorized or not.
I always thought that most fans would purchase most if not all..
David, I am going to respectfully disagree.
None of the concordances or lexicons I use professionally contain word-for-word entries to the extent we have seen with the HP Lexicon. Instead, there are paraphrases interspersed with brief direct quotes, there is a degree of textual analysis and of explanation about the symbolism used by the author in question. The extensive use of word-for-word entries taken from a primary text as found in the HP Lexicon —collating as you correctly describe the process—does not constitute originality in the least. Let’s be honest, a patient 10 year old could do that with note cards and a magic marker. And there is a huge difference between preparing a Lexicon on Richardson (mentioned recently in connection with this case), or Shakespeare, or Joyce as you mention…the first two wrote long before the legal foundations of copyright law existed, and the last is long dead (and, I would assume that any Joyce concordance was developed in consultation with the copyright holders/publishers of Ulysses)
The key for me boils down to this segment from Kristin’s summary (from the plaintiff’s arguments):
“Interest in Harry Potter Spawns Numerous Books and Websites
The document notes that the series has resulted in more than 90 books published in the U.S. alone; this section mentions several of those by name, including companion books. “Unlike the Lexicon, these Harry Potter companion guides analyze and interpret the Harry Potter books and describe the real-world underpinnings for many of Ms. Rowling’s creations. Rather than regurgitating Ms. Rowling’s text in vast quantity, these books only use brief portions of text as jumping off points for commentary or analysis related thereto”. It’s noted that the Plaintiffs have not taken legal action against any of these books.”
I had my own work plagairized and cannot do a thing about it (it would cost far too much to pursue legal action, and the possible “rewards” would be too small….); I have watched supposedly important and popular writers (Stephen Ambrose comes leaping to mind, among others) get caught plagairizing the works of others, sued, and in some cases their professional careers ruined. Why should a “lower standard” be allowed in this case for a work that does not have the scholarly value of a true lexicon or the originality of a critical analysis?
Having said that, I also want to repeat myself and beg everyone to stop any personal criticisms of either SVA or JKR (tho, thankfully, those have been fewer and less acidic in the most recent threads)...
Kristin, and the entire leaky staff, our continuing thanks for all that you do…..
PS @ plaintiffs complaining about the Lexicon entry about Lupin being incomplete: I wonder whether the Mollywobbles of this world would have liked profound explanations about the lupercalia for their ten or eleven year olds; I don’t think so. That’s why SVA would have done something to please Ms Weasly in not over-explaining wolfish elements of Roman folklore to her kids. Sirius, otoh, might have wanted them to know.
:-))
@ p.f.
What do you mean by the “mollywobbles” of this world? I feel there’s an insult hiding in there some where.
And yeah, I want my kids to be informed (when I have them). You should see how I talk to my nephews (eleven and nine years old). I patiently explain things to them and for the most part, they listen. You’d be amazed at what kids are capable of learning. Besides, it’s really not beyond them. That said, my nephews wouldn’t want a book like the Lexicon anyway, no matter if it was “on their level” or scholarly. Why? Boring. Though, only the nine year old is reading HP. He seems to understand what’s going on well enough without reading something that will just spoil him, especially as he hopes to finish the series before the final movie comes out.
Please don’t try to think for me. We don’t seem to agree on very much.
Great job Kristen!
I hope we are close to a decision. this is getting exausting! I really hope Jo is the victor and RDR gets what they deserve, nothing.
Live, Love,Harry Potter!
@ Lindsay They don’t deserve nothing. They deserve to be slapped with damages and to pay WB/JKR’s court costs. I hate to think what the final tally will be, but if RDR stays out of bankruptcy it will be a miracle.
@Briana Bickel I have read all the transcripts as well as the pre-trial exhibits. I haven’t slogged through the findings of fact yet. As far as JKR’s stealing from others, stis has already been gone over at length in the forum. From what I’ve been able to conclude there is nothing that she has used that isn’t already in the public domain. The story is based on a hero’s journey that has been retold throughout the millenium and is fully in the public domain. Can you cite me anything NOT in the public domain that she has taken?
@Briana – would you like to expand? Perhaps you are referring to the fact that the HP series is a monomyth, or a “Hero’s Journey”? Monomyths are common across cultures and have been around probably as long as man. Writing a Hero’s Journey does not constitute plagiarism.
I have read Copyright Laws and have been following this case. No matter how you look at it, this book is a simple Paste and copy of the Original HP books. I do feel badly for SVA since so many people are casting him out but I do feel that he is getting some ‘Just Desserts’ for continueing with this instead of trying to re-do the book. Also RDR Has no right to take claim to having the ‘Definitive Harry Potter Encyclopedia’ since that should be alone for JKR to do. She had information that she still has no released to the public which will be a surprise when she writes her book.
I apologize if I seem Biased but even looking at it from a legal standpoint I do not believe RDR has a leg to stand on.
honestly, im getting sick of this whole long tedious trial. dude, c’mon, you lost. you got the publicity you wanted, now DROP IT!!! WILL YOU!!!. whoever said this was right, “There comes a time in every man’s life when he should just put his tail between his legs and crawl under a bridge” amen. i applaud you. i just think this is taking so long, and the guy is a nutter if he thought he was going to get away with publishing it. oh, and Kristin, you are insane for plowing through all that. i give you a standing O for your endurance vive xe