The Chicago Tribune speaks to Roger Rapoport of RDR Books, the publishing company that is involved in a legal battle against JK Rowling and Warner Brothers over the rights to publish a book version of the HP Lexicon website.
Not a Potter fan, Mr. Rapoport was unfamiliar with the Lexicon website until he saw a newspaper profile on Vander Ark in July 2007.
“I couldn’t understand why this book hadn’t been published yet,” he said.
Rapoport is reportedly unworried about the outcome of the trial, having been told by his attorneys that “no court has ever ruled that the writer of a fictional work is the only person who can write about that book.”
According to the article, Rapoport’s has received free legal help from Stanford University Law School’s Fair Use Project. Donations to his Right to Write Foundation (formed, according to its mission statement, as “an educational repository and clearinghouse for the 21st century freedom of expression and “fair use” issues writers and publishers encounter when moving between the worlds of print, internet, film, the fine arts and new media”) have further offset costs.
Rapoport was asked about JKR’s statement from the stand of “I never ever once wanted to stop Mr. Vander Ark from doing his own guide, never ever. Do your book, but, please, change it so it does not take as much of my work.”
””That opportunity was never presented to us,” he said, his eyes flashing with anger. “The only thing they said [in the lawyer letters and pretrial discussions] was: ‘Will you stop the book?’”
Tribune article author Patrick Reardon also speaks to Steve Vander Ark, creator of the Lexicon site and main author of the Lexicon book.
“During a telephone interview from London, where he moved earlier this year to write other Potter-related books, Vander Ark said he was “devastated” when Rowling’s lawsuit was filed against RDR books, even though he wasn’t named as a defendant. “We certainly had no intention of doing something which would hurt her feelings,” Vander Ark said.”
The article reports that Vander Ark has received “nasty emails” since the lawsuit became public.
“It was disheartening how quickly people were more than happy to turn on me,” Vander Ark said.
You know, I wouldn’t have so much problem with the lexicon being published if it had quotemarks where it lifts text wholly from the books, and had proper citations for the source of each definition such as book, and page number for each first appearance of said word, character etc. That was my problem with the site the first time I saw it.
Yes, I use it – mostly for proper spellings of words as it is quicker to go there in some cases than the books, but for in depth definition and research – nope.
Sorry, Steve – I like you – I think you’re funny, but I have to stand with Jo on this – without the proper citations and quotes, my teachers would have pronounced this as plagiarism instead of Fair Use.
Even though I would like some kind of book like this its just ironic Mr. Vander Ark feels so easy about publishing his book but use to have a statement about don’t you dare copy any part of my website or I’ll be all over you – copy right -copy right – copy right – but its not stopping him from copping JK Rowlings work. go figure.
Actual legality aside, I do sort of wish that there was some law in place that granted authors to have the first shot at writing an encyclopedia of their own work.
Analysis, commentary, and speculation should be allowed so long as if falls under fair use. But it seems to me that writing an encyclopedia is not exactly “writing about” a book.
What was JK Rowling doing all the time SVA was working on his Lexicon? She was writing the HP series. She hasn’t even had a chance to write an encyclopedia of her own. I don’t care if it’s legal or not as the law stands, it just seems really awful that someone else could “scoop” an author when it comes to writing an encyclopedia of that author’s work.
Yes, others have written encyclopedias of other popular works – Lord of the Rings, Star Trek, etc. but as someone else on here pointed out, either those were licensed or they added original analysis, commentary, etc. as opposed to copying text straight from the original source to use (almost solely) as definitions for the entries.
I think JKR is right when she said that you can’t understand what it’s like if you’re not a creator (paraphrased from something she said on the stand.) I also think that when she said if RDR/SVA wins, she might not have the heart (again paraphrased) to finish her encyclopedia, it was not a threat as some people on here have speculated. Again, it’s hard to understand if you’re not involved in the creative arts. Even this trial itself is disheartening to someone who has worked to create something that is art – and have people speculate and argue about how much of what you created you own – and how much someone else can claim of your work to use for themselves to earn money.
It’s also upsetting how the media has been treating JKR in relation to this case. The amount of facts they leave out in order to conveniently shape a story that will garner attention.
You can imagine how disheartening it is to have so many people who will criticize you and assume you’re in the wrong, just because you are attempting to protect your work. And if RDR ends up winning, which will just say to the world that she was in the wrong (since the media fails to mention how much of the Lexicon book is taken straight from her text – and they fail to mention why this became a suit in the first place), it would feel like a crushing blow.
sigh What’s disheartening, Mr. Vander Ark, is your inherent lack of understanding in what you’re about to do to every Fanfiction Author, Fan Artist, Fanzine Owner, Fansite Creator.
I’ve been trying to follow the trial as best I can, and, all I can say is, the more I read about it, the more I remain steadfast in the “Go Jo!” camp. I’ve used the Lexicon site (or, rather, I did), for a quick-fix in the midst of Fic writing, and, I hardly think that a bracketed TT# (Title, Number), following a piece of work – often a paragraph or more – constitutes as citing. In fact, I’m pretty sure that if I EVER did that in an essay, my university professors would have my guts-for-garters. The amount of material that I’ve seen “on-site” at Lexicon, appears to be lifted verbatim, from the novels. Especially when it comes to the “Who’s-Who” section of the site.
As for Mr Rapoport’s comments… I find it rather lax, for someone to be so invested in this case, to not have any first hand knowledge in just what he is fighting against. The fact that he claims to have no prior knowledge of the Lexicon, to me, screams what a greedy little turd he truly is. It also makes me wonder just how much of this is done “truly for the best interest of the fans”.
I don’t see this resulting in publishing companies coming out of the wood-work, to ask me to publish my Harry Potter fanfiction, or anyone else for that matter. After all, isn’t what I do in my spare time, pretty much everything that falls under the “Fair Use” excuses that RDR and SVA seem to be claiming? If not moreso, because whilst I use the characters JKR has pesented to me, none of their situations are even remotely concurrent with hers? Nope, didn’t think so.
By the by, if RDR and SVA win, I will picket the several bookstores in my area, and let anyone who even looks at buying it, that, why spend $29.95, when you can glean the information off the net, for free?
One thing still bugs me:
how can someone claim copyright infringement and claim a book is 90% copied of one original work, when never having seen a copy before the lawsuit was filed. Rapoport did not hand down a copy of the Lexicon manuscript before oktober 31…. (trancripts) and by that date and in the advance of it already was concluded that language and text was copied and pasted…. somebody must have been psychic here, make you wonder this case was even received by the court, it probably would not have been when not a very famous name had been involved.
But win or loose I am glad mr.Rapoport, not infected by any pro-or anti JKR virus deceided to stand his ground, now JKR has to come up with something solid on the Encyclopedia-field, just to proove with hard copy, as she believes, she alone is capable of systematicing the HP data, in stead of have her fans dangling for an other ten or twenty years.
during this whole period, counting from July 21, there has been a lot of news about JKR, but never a decisive announchement: “I start writing the Encyclodia, then and then.” a lot of sometimes and anytimes, but nothing the fans could count on.
that’s not what I can conclude from JKR’s own statement,
neither from Cendali’s communication to Rapaport,
“Stop this book!” was her only message —without even prior consulting with JKR herself that may have worked at Mugglenet-—how nice for being a no. UNO JKR-fansite, to be barked on by a message service——but not with a editor who has no emotial report with HP and all its’parnephenalia what so ever..
he book contains critical analysis from “Steven Vander Ark and his staff.” When asked what he meant by critical analysis Mr. Harris said, “You can go to the site and read the articles. I’m not going to itemise them for you.” Questioned further he said “the book was typeset directly from the site,” and that it was word-for-word taken from the web site. (The RDR Web site now says “The entire book is drawn verbatim from the material that presently appears on Steve Vander Ark’s website.”)
RDR claims the book is not an infringement because “it’s a critical and educational review,” and, “we are not simply rearranging information.” Mr. Harris said a large portion of the book was “probably” typeset from the lexicon directly, though had “no idea” what proportion of the book is essays as compared to a catalogue of info. (However, there have been statements by Lexicon staff quoting Steve, that state there will be no essays in the book. Some essay authors are stating publicly that they have not been approached for permission.)
RDR claims not to have given JKR’s people a copy of the book because “we don’t have a copy to give them…because the book hasn’t been published yet.” Asked why they didn’t hand over a manuscript, Mr. Harris said, “how would it benefit us in any way? This is the result of a barrage of letters from their lawyers in the last two months. Late in the game they came forward and wanted to see the manuscript, after they’ve been threatening to sue us and everything. How is it going to help us in any way to show them the manuscript except to provide them with more information. At this stage are they going to say, ‘Oh, we’re sorry?’ and go away? I don’t think so.”
When you get told that the book and the website are the same you may get the idea that it’s copyright theft
In the past I have purchased several Harry Potter analysis books and have enjoyed the fanfiction on the web. This was mainly to “tide me over” until the next novel was published.
HOWEVER, SVA (Even though he is not named as a defendant in the suit but the whole Bloody thing is his fault) RDR and their lawyers are just a bunch of bottom feeders…just like SVA.. And his allegation that he wants to write more Harry Potter related books, you can bet that I am going to be very conscious of the by-line when I buy books from now on! ... the man is a leech and has no original imagination of his own!
Does anybody happen to see the “coincidences”? He seems to be trying to approximate JKR … He has moved to London … Has he started frequently traveling on the Manchester train (waiting for Divine inspiration)? ... Is he hanging out in neighborhood cafes?
Okay, to reiterate/elaborate from the post I made at the end of the Neil Gaiman thread…
A lexicon is a dictionary. A listing of words in alphabetical order with definitions. Generally, a lexicon does not have a whole lot of interpretation…otherwise it wouldn’t be a lexicon, it would be an interpretive work. This, however, does not make it less of a reference work … it’s just a specific type of reference work that tends to be light on analysis. Consider it an abridged dictionary as opposed to the OED.
So yes, the book probably does have “91%” of JKR content…because the words and concepts are from her book. How can you have a lexicon describing a fictional world without using the words from the books it is referencing?
Now, if he hasn’t attributed enough back to JKR? BIG no-no, and as a librarian, he should know better. He needs to sit down, turn around and properly attribute everything. If, say, Tudor scholars writing about the Anne Boleyn saga can do it, so can he. But the kicker is if he defined a term/described a character and didn’t use really exact, canon-based terminology, wouldn’t the Potter fandom jump down his throat for being inaccurate? It’s a Catch-22 situation.
I’m on the side of intellectual property here. Because creating a lexicon from varied sources … even with staff … is not easy. If you don’t believe me, sit down with any one of the books and write a lexicon on your own. You can either create fresh, intellectual-property-conflict-free definitions, which takes lots of creativity and time (especially since JKR seems to feel she owns the copyright of every word she ever wrote or every idea she ever had, which is actually a bit troubling, as you can find many references to earlier fantasy works in her work). Or you can properly reference the books, which takes lots of exacting patience, anal retentive tendencies, and time. ;)
That JKR hasn’t written hers yet and doesn’t intend on publishing it for quite some time should tell you how much work is involved in something like this. She created the universe and presumably has her own notes … shouldn’t it be relatively quick for her to assemble? It’s her world!
And besides, proper lexicons do provide value to any fictional universe, HP included. (If it didn’t, would MuggleNet have tried to come out with one of their own?) Fans of the books like me … who own the 7 main books and have re-read them several times, and have seen and own the movies, but haven’t so much have breathed on any of the Canon supplement materials … would actually find use from a good print lexicon. (Because I always found the HPL site a bit unwieldy, due to the massive amount of content … the human eye simply can’t process that much content on a computer screen well. And you can’t dog-ear or highlight the site like you can a reference book ;) )
I’m not an idiot, but I’m not a child, with their incredible, sponge-like brains and attention span. There are times when I read the books and thought to myself, “Wait, now who is that/what was that again?”
Because the howls over “kids can follow Harry Potter but Judge Patterson can’t” were blown out of proportion. I volunteer with kids to teach dinosaurs, and it is astounding how much they know. More than most intelligent adults know, and in reality, the complexity of popular dinosaur knowledge isn’t too far removed from the complexity of the HP Universe. Kids like to and can actually quite easily wrap their heads around complex concepts if you give them a chance, and have nice fresh, young, absorbent brain cells. Some of us adults … who are experts in other fields and have deeper passions that consume our spare brain cells … need a boost to help us get through our recreational reading.
Now, again … I would most definitely like to see any unattributed text in the book properly referenced. Because that’s how it’s done. And I don’t care if 91% of the book is referenced material, as long as the author and editor are up front about it. Because not only has JKR not written a lexicon yet, she also neglected to build any supporting materials built into the main books. This book would be a step towards rectifying that situation.
JKR provides no glossary, no footnotes, no appendices, no family trees (other than the brief piece on the Black Family, but that’s just described, not shown, if I remember correctly) in the main books. Nothing there for those of us who might need some more concrete explanations or reference pieces removed from the narrative flow. That doesn’t make me (or any of us) stupid … it just means we can’t devote quite as many brain cells to the HP Universe as some.
If you buy a copy of Lord of the Rings, for example, there are appendices. Huge, whonkin’ appendices (some of the material in the movies actually came from those appendices) ... in my one-volume addition, they run slightly over 100 pages (of very small text on very large pages). And there’s even an index (though interestingly, that was not complied by Tolkien…but he had promised to write one ;) )!
All of the appendices are from JRR Tolkien and were part of the book … it is actually referenced in sections of the narrative. So if you wanted to read up more on a concept, see the “Shire” calendar, or check out a family tree, well, Tolkien provided it all for you in one tidy (if massive) package.
JKR did no such thing. (Though it is fair to say that she is writing in a different time … publishing pressure being what it is, she didn’t have the luxury of time that Tolkien had. He also wrote the book in its entirety … it was published in three sections for economy, not because he was writing installments.)
This whole thing is murky, and no one is completely in the right. Even though JKR does have the right to defend her own work, she is being somewhat dramatic and hypocritical. (As one of the linked-to articles here mentioned with some excess vitriol – she’s totally okay to let WB make a Harry Potter theme park? That’s protecting the integrity of her works? And I’m sorry – I thought her tears were a bit of the crocodilian nature for her first day on the stand, considering the harder stance she took on the last day.)
But you know what? You can say the same about SVA. The Lexicon represents a lot of work (even if he’s just the editor and not the full author), and he has the right to defend that. But SVA is sounding more and more smug and martyr-ish (his tears, too, were of the crocodile nature, I think, considering how he’s bounced back for interviews), and I’m not buying into that. If he had RDR write in a clause about legal protection, he knew he was dipping his toe into muddy waters.
And RDR is obviously, more than ever, just out to make a buck, so I’ve got no sympathy for them. But I’ve got no sympathy for WB either … if they had just let this book get published, it probably would have gotten much less attention. There’s no such thing as 100% bad press … there are now thousands of people who know about the HPL site and this book who didn’t before. People who will visit the site (and possibly contribute to the ad revenue), or people who may buy the book if RDR wins. Sometimes, the best revenge is just dismissing something and watching it wither on the vine, not fighting it and watching it thrive on the action.
It’s all gray. And I feel sorry for Judge Patterson – there’s too much good and bad in each case to make a concrete decision that will stand as legal precedent down the line.
Just a quick question. Bookstores obviously choose what they order so who is to say that even a majority of bookstores will jump on this book even if it does get past the lawsuit. Didn’t a bunch of bookstores pull out when there was a lawsuit in the first place? I don’t think it’s guaranteed that they will all just jump back in and place orders just because it gets past a lawsuit. They may not want to purchase a book whose very publication is so rife with controversy. Not to mention, bookstores had made a nice dime off of Jo…would the big guns (B&N, Borders,etc.) really just throw any loyalty aside and purchase copies (especially when I doubt it’s going to make that much money anyway)?
I respect the way you stated your opinion. I agree that the whole thing is really murky. I think where I get my hackles up is when I read pro-RDR stuff that is so blatantly slanted as to not even address the real issues in the case (and since most of the media coverage could be argued to be pro-RDR, there is a lot of such stuff to get my hackles up about).
Like for example, Rapoport says “no court has ever ruled that the author of a fictional work is the only person who can write about that book,” which is completely irrelevant, as no such case has ever existed so no court even COULD make such a ruling. But it sounds good, which is I’m sure why Rapoport was repeating it.
I mean, it’s like saying “No court has ever ruled that the sky is red.” Well, of course not because such a case has never been tried. But I haven’t seen anyone trying to defend Rapoport yet, so I guess I am preaching to the choir.
Ohh Steve sigh
He himself is Jo’s biggest fan, that’s why he started the Lexicon in the first place, and it’s evident from his appearances on PotterCast. He seems like a very genuine guy too, so it fails me why he didn’t just refuse the offer from Rapoport (it sounds like that’s how it went down) and KEEP it as a website, it’s such a great tool as is—Jo has even said this herself! It’s sad that it’s now come to this. I don’t “hate” him, but honestly it’s hard to understand the situation when it sounds like he is not respecting Jo’s wishes.
Posted by Rownak Choudhury = ) on May 04, 2008, 06:26 PM
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You know, I wouldn’t have so much problem with the lexicon being published if it had quotemarks where it lifts text wholly from the books, and had proper citations for the source of each definition such as book, and page number for each first appearance of said word, character etc. That was my problem with the site the first time I saw it.
Yes, I use it – mostly for proper spellings of words as it is quicker to go there in some cases than the books, but for in depth definition and research – nope.
Sorry, Steve – I like you – I think you’re funny, but I have to stand with Jo on this – without the proper citations and quotes, my teachers would have pronounced this as plagiarism instead of Fair Use.